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	<title>Comments on: In Spain they still shoot wolves&#8230;</title>
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		<title>By: Peter the Brit</title>
		<link>http://www.notesfromspain.com/2008/10/23/in-spain-they-still-shoot-wolves/comment-page-1/#comment-92847</link>
		<dc:creator>Peter the Brit</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 27 Mar 2009 09:59:45 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.notesfromspain.com/?p=1074#comment-92847</guid>
		<description>yes, shoot the wolves.....they devour livestock and would take your children too if they were within reach too.  don&#039;t impose human emotions on wolves.  they are one of nature&#039;s most proficient killers....</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>yes, shoot the wolves&#8230;..they devour livestock and would take your children too if they were within reach too.  don&#8217;t impose human emotions on wolves.  they are one of nature&#8217;s most proficient killers&#8230;.</p>
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		<title>By: Edith</title>
		<link>http://www.notesfromspain.com/2008/10/23/in-spain-they-still-shoot-wolves/comment-page-1/#comment-59966</link>
		<dc:creator>Edith</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 04 Nov 2008 21:09:40 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.notesfromspain.com/?p=1074#comment-59966</guid>
		<description>@ Raytibbitts,

¿Quién sabe? ;-)</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>@ Raytibbitts,</p>
<p>¿Quién sabe? <img src='http://www.notesfromspain.com/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_wink.gif' alt=';-)' class='wp-smiley' /> </p>
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		<title>By: raytibbitts</title>
		<link>http://www.notesfromspain.com/2008/10/23/in-spain-they-still-shoot-wolves/comment-page-1/#comment-59913</link>
		<dc:creator>raytibbitts</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 04 Nov 2008 17:15:01 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.notesfromspain.com/?p=1074#comment-59913</guid>
		<description>It just occurred to me (I&#039;m a bit slow) that it may have been more than one rattler...

After seeing this video:
http://www.mefeedia.com/entry/town-rattled-by-rattlesnakes/12117510</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>It just occurred to me (I&#8217;m a bit slow) that it may have been more than one rattler&#8230;</p>
<p>After seeing this video:<br />
<a href="http://www.mefeedia.com/entry/town-rattled-by-rattlesnakes/12117510" rel="nofollow">http://www.mefeedia.com/entry/town-rattled-by-rattlesnakes/12117510</a></p>
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		<title>By: Edith</title>
		<link>http://www.notesfromspain.com/2008/10/23/in-spain-they-still-shoot-wolves/comment-page-1/#comment-59214</link>
		<dc:creator>Edith</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 01 Nov 2008 10:08:32 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.notesfromspain.com/?p=1074#comment-59214</guid>
		<description>Great post, Raytibbitts! I couldn&#039;t agree more.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Great post, Raytibbitts! I couldn&#8217;t agree more.</p>
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		<title>By: raytibbitts</title>
		<link>http://www.notesfromspain.com/2008/10/23/in-spain-they-still-shoot-wolves/comment-page-1/#comment-59156</link>
		<dc:creator>raytibbitts</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 01 Nov 2008 04:22:46 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.notesfromspain.com/?p=1074#comment-59156</guid>
		<description>Eastern Diamondbacks are protected in some areas, and the property in question backed up against public lands.  I assume that there is some chance that this particular snake may have been protected.  It was not in North Carolina.

This family had all the permits to build on their property, and we built it where they wanted it.
After clearing the trees and brush, and digging the footers, I am convinced that we saw burrows of animals that would have fed many snakes, especially a big one.

It was late in the year, I had the best heat-signature in the forest, and I&#039;m sure the recent lack of food had something to do with the snake&#039;s curiosity, and it may have not been specifically following me, but I perceived it that way.  I mean, my &quot;friend&quot; did.

I have had many experiences with Western Diamondbacks in Southern California, and I have never had one stick around in an area that I had entered into.  The always run, and then run some more if you happen to be headed in the same direction as them.  But if they stop, they usually seem pretty angry about being bothered, and they look dangerous enough that I have never stuck around to find out what would happen, but instead, I have altered my course to avoid them, or gone back out the way I came in.
This was the first time running into a snake when I couldn&#039;t easily yell and be heard by neighbors.  It was also the first time where it would have effected my job performance had I decided to just go away.
I still regret that the snake died.

All life is valuable.  Poisoning, trapping, hunting, and making sport of killing animals really is wasteful, and it can even come back to &#039;bite&#039; us.  I don&#039;t think that it is necessary to abstain from eating meat altogether, but a healthier diet is one with low amounts of animal products in it.  Animals don&#039;t have the same basic &#039;rights&#039; as humans, they are not equal with us, and I don&#039;t believe we are somehow enemies of Nature, which is why it is our responsibility to use our greater capacities to keep it that way.  Limiting ourselves and making compromises is part of being human, some basic principles should never be compromised, but sometimes it makes sense for an individual to forego certain wants and desires, in order to diminish the impact on wildlife, as well as farm animals.  We are the humans, we are the only ones with the mandate to be humane.

Making sport out of their deaths makes us LESS human.

Over the millennia, societies&#039; perceptions of these ethical questions have evolved.  I am gald that there are no longer very many people who only eat meat that they knew personally when it was alive, nor have to hunt to find.  I like enjoying a delicious meal, being several times removed from the animals that died to make me happy.  Not that I like not knowing, but I like having the choice.

I wonder what the future holds, and how society will continue to evolve around these issues.  We are not far from being able to grow hamburger in a lab, without it ever having been a part of a cow.  There will be ways to make lab-grown meat that is indistinguishable from certain cuts of actual animals. I wonder how long before it is financially feasible, and how many will choose to eat it, instead of farm-raised meat?

Will I ever lament the possible side-effects of my grandkids eating lab-meat, the way my grandfather suspects that never eating the meat of an animal we hunted (or fished) for ourselves is the cause of general &quot;wimpy-ness&quot; among his grandkids?

I wonder.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Eastern Diamondbacks are protected in some areas, and the property in question backed up against public lands.  I assume that there is some chance that this particular snake may have been protected.  It was not in North Carolina.</p>
<p>This family had all the permits to build on their property, and we built it where they wanted it.<br />
After clearing the trees and brush, and digging the footers, I am convinced that we saw burrows of animals that would have fed many snakes, especially a big one.</p>
<p>It was late in the year, I had the best heat-signature in the forest, and I&#8217;m sure the recent lack of food had something to do with the snake&#8217;s curiosity, and it may have not been specifically following me, but I perceived it that way.  I mean, my &#8220;friend&#8221; did.</p>
<p>I have had many experiences with Western Diamondbacks in Southern California, and I have never had one stick around in an area that I had entered into.  The always run, and then run some more if you happen to be headed in the same direction as them.  But if they stop, they usually seem pretty angry about being bothered, and they look dangerous enough that I have never stuck around to find out what would happen, but instead, I have altered my course to avoid them, or gone back out the way I came in.<br />
This was the first time running into a snake when I couldn&#8217;t easily yell and be heard by neighbors.  It was also the first time where it would have effected my job performance had I decided to just go away.<br />
I still regret that the snake died.</p>
<p>All life is valuable.  Poisoning, trapping, hunting, and making sport of killing animals really is wasteful, and it can even come back to &#8216;bite&#8217; us.  I don&#8217;t think that it is necessary to abstain from eating meat altogether, but a healthier diet is one with low amounts of animal products in it.  Animals don&#8217;t have the same basic &#8216;rights&#8217; as humans, they are not equal with us, and I don&#8217;t believe we are somehow enemies of Nature, which is why it is our responsibility to use our greater capacities to keep it that way.  Limiting ourselves and making compromises is part of being human, some basic principles should never be compromised, but sometimes it makes sense for an individual to forego certain wants and desires, in order to diminish the impact on wildlife, as well as farm animals.  We are the humans, we are the only ones with the mandate to be humane.</p>
<p>Making sport out of their deaths makes us LESS human.</p>
<p>Over the millennia, societies&#8217; perceptions of these ethical questions have evolved.  I am gald that there are no longer very many people who only eat meat that they knew personally when it was alive, nor have to hunt to find.  I like enjoying a delicious meal, being several times removed from the animals that died to make me happy.  Not that I like not knowing, but I like having the choice.</p>
<p>I wonder what the future holds, and how society will continue to evolve around these issues.  We are not far from being able to grow hamburger in a lab, without it ever having been a part of a cow.  There will be ways to make lab-grown meat that is indistinguishable from certain cuts of actual animals. I wonder how long before it is financially feasible, and how many will choose to eat it, instead of farm-raised meat?</p>
<p>Will I ever lament the possible side-effects of my grandkids eating lab-meat, the way my grandfather suspects that never eating the meat of an animal we hunted (or fished) for ourselves is the cause of general &#8220;wimpy-ness&#8221; among his grandkids?</p>
<p>I wonder.</p>
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		<title>By: Edith</title>
		<link>http://www.notesfromspain.com/2008/10/23/in-spain-they-still-shoot-wolves/comment-page-1/#comment-59023</link>
		<dc:creator>Edith</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 31 Oct 2008 14:10:32 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.notesfromspain.com/?p=1074#comment-59023</guid>
		<description>Do snakes really sneak up on people, or do they just want to be left alone? 
In Arizona, I had an encounter with a western diamond snake once, which rattled at me to warn me I was entering his territory, and after I backed off he disappeared into the underbrush.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Do snakes really sneak up on people, or do they just want to be left alone?<br />
In Arizona, I had an encounter with a western diamond snake once, which rattled at me to warn me I was entering his territory, and after I backed off he disappeared into the underbrush.</p>
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		<title>By: John Ross</title>
		<link>http://www.notesfromspain.com/2008/10/23/in-spain-they-still-shoot-wolves/comment-page-1/#comment-59012</link>
		<dc:creator>John Ross</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 31 Oct 2008 12:41:56 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.notesfromspain.com/?p=1074#comment-59012</guid>
		<description>Good story. Are rattlers protected, then? Odd behaviour, I&#039;d have thought - most snakes don&#039;t have nests to protect, so why would it pursue (the person in question)?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Good story. Are rattlers protected, then? Odd behaviour, I&#8217;d have thought &#8211; most snakes don&#8217;t have nests to protect, so why would it pursue (the person in question)?</p>
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		<title>By: raytibbitts</title>
		<link>http://www.notesfromspain.com/2008/10/23/in-spain-they-still-shoot-wolves/comment-page-1/#comment-58956</link>
		<dc:creator>raytibbitts</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 31 Oct 2008 05:12:10 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.notesfromspain.com/?p=1074#comment-58956</guid>
		<description>For some reason I just remembered a somewhat related story.
Let&#039;s say that a friend of mine, just in case the statute of limitations isn&#039;t up yet, killed an enormous eastern diamondback rattlesnake.
He was alone on a construction site, against company (and OSHA) guidelines.   It was getting late in the afternoon, and a snake appeared, distracting him from doing his assignment of completing a quality-control checklist, and replacing a few twisted studs, before they could start sheetrock.
If he went &#039;inside&#039; it followed him inside, outside - outside, howbeit more slowly than him, as he strolled about completing his tasks.
He became dismayed when it began to follow him more closely as he went to the truck, parked near the tree line, to fetch some tools.  So he tossed a hammer at it to see if it would go away, but completely missed, and the serpent began to get too close for comfort.  So he tossed a larger, sledge-sized one at it, and it appeared to bounce off it&#039;s head. (Maybe he missed again?)
It then began to coil and angrily shake its rattle, appearing to get bigger, thicker, and taller.  It lunged at the air a little, and the guy got up in the bed of the truck, and decided he was never going to get his job done before it got too dark, unless he got rid of the snake.  
There were several large cinder blocks in the back of the truck with him, and he first thought of dropping them down and just pinning the snake to the ground with their weight, at least until he could finish his job.  He really didn&#039;t want to kill the animal, but adrenaline was making some of his decisions for him, as the snake was now between him and his own vehicle, he didn&#039;t have keys to the truck, there was no cellphone coverage, and no neighbors for at least half a mile.
He tried to just drop a block as directly onto the rattler as possible, but it was just too far off the tailgate get the angle right, and it was looking right back at his face the whole time, and he actually missed, AGAIN.  The snake moved to the side a bit, but no closer to the pickup.  The next block he hefted over landed on the midsection of the snake, and it sank, snake and all,  half the depth of the brick into the soft clayey soil, which was all the more softened from the rains earlier that afternoon.
At first, it looked like it was going to work, and he started looking for a 2x4 he could use later to free the snake, before he left.  When he looked back towards the snake, it had wiggled forward about six inches, exposing the portion of its body that had sustained the impact of the brick.  It was about to inch forward again, but blood appeared, gushing up from the little mud cave that formed around it, from under the block.  It was writhing in what he assumed to be pain, and he felt immediate remorse, and a little disillusioned that such a big strong snake was so easy to hurt.
He chose to &#039;put it out of its misery.&#039;  Selecting a heavier, solid concrete block, (the first one was one of those hollow kind,) and he slammed it down closer to the snake&#039;s head, as it had managed to work itself most of the way free.  Now that it was pinned again, and didn&#039;t have enough free length to strike, he jumped down, and ran quickly to get a long, sharp-edged piece of metal, and cut the head off in one stroke.
He took photos, and a video of it, which he showed to his wife once, when he was trying to explain what took him so long to get home that night.  She demanded he tell it to her family. Ever since he showed his in-laws, he decided to never show anyone else, ever again.  
 It really bothered him how he was trying to tell it like he felt forced into having to kill something that he wished had just gone away on its own, but they were obviously hearing it like some amazing story of a monster being slain, by an the guy &#039;you-never-would-have-thought-had-it-in-him&#039; no less.

Okay, honestly, he didn&#039;t tell his wife until that particular house was finished, and he never had to go back, and only after she had been bugging him several times about being careful on distant job-sites, asking him what would happen if he was by himself and something dangerous showed up.

He kept the rattle.  (His mother-in-law nearly kicked him out of her house when she came across it, as she was nosing through his belongings.)  Served her right, if she really was as terrified by it as she claimed.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>For some reason I just remembered a somewhat related story.<br />
Let&#8217;s say that a friend of mine, just in case the statute of limitations isn&#8217;t up yet, killed an enormous eastern diamondback rattlesnake.<br />
He was alone on a construction site, against company (and OSHA) guidelines.   It was getting late in the afternoon, and a snake appeared, distracting him from doing his assignment of completing a quality-control checklist, and replacing a few twisted studs, before they could start sheetrock.<br />
If he went &#8216;inside&#8217; it followed him inside, outside &#8211; outside, howbeit more slowly than him, as he strolled about completing his tasks.<br />
He became dismayed when it began to follow him more closely as he went to the truck, parked near the tree line, to fetch some tools.  So he tossed a hammer at it to see if it would go away, but completely missed, and the serpent began to get too close for comfort.  So he tossed a larger, sledge-sized one at it, and it appeared to bounce off it&#8217;s head. (Maybe he missed again?)<br />
It then began to coil and angrily shake its rattle, appearing to get bigger, thicker, and taller.  It lunged at the air a little, and the guy got up in the bed of the truck, and decided he was never going to get his job done before it got too dark, unless he got rid of the snake.<br />
There were several large cinder blocks in the back of the truck with him, and he first thought of dropping them down and just pinning the snake to the ground with their weight, at least until he could finish his job.  He really didn&#8217;t want to kill the animal, but adrenaline was making some of his decisions for him, as the snake was now between him and his own vehicle, he didn&#8217;t have keys to the truck, there was no cellphone coverage, and no neighbors for at least half a mile.<br />
He tried to just drop a block as directly onto the rattler as possible, but it was just too far off the tailgate get the angle right, and it was looking right back at his face the whole time, and he actually missed, AGAIN.  The snake moved to the side a bit, but no closer to the pickup.  The next block he hefted over landed on the midsection of the snake, and it sank, snake and all,  half the depth of the brick into the soft clayey soil, which was all the more softened from the rains earlier that afternoon.<br />
At first, it looked like it was going to work, and he started looking for a 2&#215;4 he could use later to free the snake, before he left.  When he looked back towards the snake, it had wiggled forward about six inches, exposing the portion of its body that had sustained the impact of the brick.  It was about to inch forward again, but blood appeared, gushing up from the little mud cave that formed around it, from under the block.  It was writhing in what he assumed to be pain, and he felt immediate remorse, and a little disillusioned that such a big strong snake was so easy to hurt.<br />
He chose to &#8216;put it out of its misery.&#8217;  Selecting a heavier, solid concrete block, (the first one was one of those hollow kind,) and he slammed it down closer to the snake&#8217;s head, as it had managed to work itself most of the way free.  Now that it was pinned again, and didn&#8217;t have enough free length to strike, he jumped down, and ran quickly to get a long, sharp-edged piece of metal, and cut the head off in one stroke.<br />
He took photos, and a video of it, which he showed to his wife once, when he was trying to explain what took him so long to get home that night.  She demanded he tell it to her family. Ever since he showed his in-laws, he decided to never show anyone else, ever again.<br />
 It really bothered him how he was trying to tell it like he felt forced into having to kill something that he wished had just gone away on its own, but they were obviously hearing it like some amazing story of a monster being slain, by an the guy &#8216;you-never-would-have-thought-had-it-in-him&#8217; no less.</p>
<p>Okay, honestly, he didn&#8217;t tell his wife until that particular house was finished, and he never had to go back, and only after she had been bugging him several times about being careful on distant job-sites, asking him what would happen if he was by himself and something dangerous showed up.</p>
<p>He kept the rattle.  (His mother-in-law nearly kicked him out of her house when she came across it, as she was nosing through his belongings.)  Served her right, if she really was as terrified by it as she claimed.</p>
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		<title>By: sven</title>
		<link>http://www.notesfromspain.com/2008/10/23/in-spain-they-still-shoot-wolves/comment-page-1/#comment-58873</link>
		<dc:creator>sven</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 29 Oct 2008 19:47:40 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.notesfromspain.com/?p=1074#comment-58873</guid>
		<description>do not kill wolves anywhere they have a role in the natural balance</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>do not kill wolves anywhere they have a role in the natural balance</p>
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		<title>By: Edith</title>
		<link>http://www.notesfromspain.com/2008/10/23/in-spain-they-still-shoot-wolves/comment-page-1/#comment-58821</link>
		<dc:creator>Edith</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 26 Oct 2008 09:00:34 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.notesfromspain.com/?p=1074#comment-58821</guid>
		<description>@ ValenciaSon,

Do you mind if I join you at the table? :D</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>@ ValenciaSon,</p>
<p>Do you mind if I join you at the table? <img src='http://www.notesfromspain.com/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_biggrin.gif' alt=':D' class='wp-smiley' /> </p>
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