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Old 1st March 2008, 11:29 AM   #1
gastephen
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Default hubo / había

Un aspecto de la dicotomía del pretérito indefinido / imperfecto que aún no me queda bien claro es cuando se debe usar hubo y cuando se debe usar había (en el sentido de there was / were). Supongo que utilizas hubo respecto a los sucesos y había al describir el 'escenario', pero no estoy muy seguro. ¿Podéis aclarármelo y darme unos ejemplos? Gracias de antemano.

Last edited by gastephen; 1st March 2008 at 05:35 PM.
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Old 1st March 2008, 11:47 AM   #2
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There is some information in this book that may help you. (p.121 if the link takes you somewhere else )
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Old 1st March 2008, 12:31 PM   #3
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Well it's the same as any of the preterite/imperfect issues. You will almost always be using había as usually things are usually there for a period of time, however short, rather than just appearing there spontaneously. I wonder if I'm missing some subtlety in your question here as your Spanish is 1000 times better than mine.

I can only think of hubo being used for something spontaneous like an accident. As the cat often says I'm sure someone that actually knows somthing will come along soon.

...or if something was there for a period of time that is stated and then no longer there (I added this later in case someone doesn't follow up greytop's link)

Last edited by tad; 1st March 2008 at 02:51 PM.
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Old 1st March 2008, 12:39 PM   #4
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Or even simpler, check the link that Greytop provided, it's very helpful.
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Old 1st March 2008, 12:47 PM   #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Elvis View Post
Or even simpler, check the link that Greytop provided, it's very helpful.
Oh yeah.
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Old 1st March 2008, 01:57 PM   #6
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Thanks Greytop and Tad,
Now to add to the confusion...
I don't understand when to use the plural form of haber to mean there were and when not.

For example, do I say:
Hubo muchos accidentes... o
Hubieron muchos accidentes.

Había muchas personas.... o
Habían muchas personas.

I thought there is/there are= hay and there was/there were=hubo or había. But I have seen many examples like:
Hubieron muchos incendios, etc.

So now I'm confused.


Last edited by DocMolly; 1st March 2008 at 01:59 PM.
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Old 1st March 2008, 02:07 PM   #7
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Something maybe related to this is that when a book teaches you the word hay for there is/are it says something like 'this is a form of the verb haber'
but if you look at a verb table for haber, no 'hay' is there.
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Old 1st March 2008, 02:08 PM   #8
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"Hay" is not pluralised.
Había muchas personas, hubo problemas, ha habido unas quejas..,hubo muchos incendios.
Hubieron problemas-incendios is wrong!



Quote:
Originally Posted by DocMolly View Post
Thanks Greytop and Tad,
Now to add to the confusion...
I don't understand when to use the plural form of haber to mean there were and when not.

For example, do I say:
Hubo muchos accidentes... o
Hubieron muchos accidentes.

Había muchas personas.... o
Habían muchas personas.

I thought there is/there are= hay and there was/there were=hubo or había. But I have seen many examples like:
Hubieron muchos incendios, etc.

So now I'm confused.


Last edited by omeyas; 1st March 2008 at 02:12 PM.
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Old 1st March 2008, 06:08 PM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by greytop View Post
There is some information in this book that may help you. (p.121 if the link takes you somewhere else )
Gracias por el enlace. Tiene muy buena pinta aquel libro. Estoy tentado de comprarlo.
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Old 1st March 2008, 06:17 PM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tad View Post
I wonder if I'm missing some subtlety in your question
No, realmente no. Parece que es más o menos lo que pensaba. Yo debía de complicarlo sin razón, o quizá es que sencillamente tenía un bloqueo con eso.
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Old 1st March 2008, 06:47 PM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gastephen View Post
Gracias por el enlace. Tiene muy buena pinta aquel libro. Estoy tentado de comprarlo.
Lo tengo y creo que es bueno.

Karen
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Old 1st March 2008, 07:54 PM   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by karena View Post
Lo tengo y creo que es bueno.

Karen
Ajá. Tu recomendación es más que suficiente para mí. Ya voy a Amazon...
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Old 1st March 2008, 08:20 PM   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by omeyas View Post
"Hay" is not pluralised.
Había muchas personas, hubo problemas, ha habido unas quejas..,hubo muchos incendios.
Hubieron problemas-incendios is wrong!
Gracias Frank. Yo siempre pensaba esto, pero una de mis amigas latinas, me corregió cuando dije:
"Hubo muchos eventos." Ella respondió: "Hubieron muchos eventos."

Pero sí es ella quien se equivoca, porque el sujeto es "There," as in There were many events. Pero, de verdad, he notado el uso de hubieron para decir "there were," en varias otras ocasiones.

Pues, esto es prueba que no tienes que hablar perfectamente. Hasta los nativos hablan con unos pequeños errores.

Last edited by DocMolly; 1st March 2008 at 10:54 PM.
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Old 1st March 2008, 09:17 PM   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DocMolly View Post
Gracias Frank. Yo siempre pensaba esto, pero una de mis amigas latinas, me corregió cuando dije:
"Hubo muchos eventos." Ella respondió: "Hubieron muchos eventos."
Molly, en mi libro, Butt & Benjamin(un libro muy bueno) dice,
Había tres chicas, never habían tres chicas.
In Spain, the plural construction is stigmatised as uneducated, but it is a very common feature of everyday Castilian, as spoken en Catalonia. In Latin America, it is universally common in everyday, even educated speech, and it quite frequently appears in informal writing (eg. newspapers), but it is not accepted in careful styles.

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Old 1st March 2008, 10:53 PM   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by omeyas View Post
Molly, en mi libro, Butt & Benjamin(un libro muy bueno) dice,
Había tres chicas, never habían tres chicas.
In Spain, the plural construction is stigmatised as uneducated, but it is a very common feature of everyday Castilian, as spoken en Catalonia. In Latin America, it is universally common in everyday, even educated speech, and it quite frequently appears in informal writing (eg. newspapers), but it is not accepted in careful styles.
Thanks Frank. That clears up a lot. Learning a language is so much more than learning the vocabulary and grammar.
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Old 1st March 2008, 11:26 PM   #16
ese
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DocMolly View Post
Gracias Frank. Yo siempre pensaba esto, pero una de mis amigas latinas, me corregió cuando dije:
"Hubo muchos eventos." Ella respondió: "Hubieron muchos eventos."

Pero sí es ella quien se equivoca, porque el sujeto es "There," as in There were many events. Pero, de verdad, he notado el uso de hubieron para decir "there were," en varias otras ocasiones.

Pues, esto es prueba que no tienes que hablar perfectamente. Hasta los nativos hablan con unos pequeños errores.
En Sudámerica es posible que sea válido. En España, desde luego está mal dicho. En algunas zonas de España, como Cataluña, algunas personas cometen ese error por la influencia del catalán (por ejemplo dicen "han habido muchas cosas", cuando lo correcto sería es "ha habido muchas cosas". También les pasa con hubo y hubieron.
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Old 2nd March 2008, 12:26 PM   #17
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Just read this in Harry Potter 6:

«...es más, hubo un horrible instante en que creyó ver cómo la mirada de Malfoy seguía la fugaz trayectoria de uno de sus zapatos deportivos..»

here hubo indicates 'an instant' of time.
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Old 2nd March 2008, 05:22 PM   #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ese View Post
En Sudámerica es posible que sea válido. En España, desde luego está mal dicho. En algunas zonas de España, como Cataluña, algunas personas cometen ese error por la influencia del catalán (por ejemplo dicen "han habido muchas cosas", cuando lo correcto sería es "ha habido muchas cosas". También les pasa con hubo y hubieron.
Gracias a Ese y a todos! Me encanta este foro. Siempre me brindáis información bien útil. Gracias.
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