Notes from Spain and Spanish Forum

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-   -   Americans working in Spain. (http://www.notesfromspain.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1052)

Ben 5th October 2006 01:38 PM

Americans working in Spain.
 
A: The happy-go-lucky no-work-Visa way:

Here are a few tips I picked up from a recent chat with an American girl who has been working out here for over two years with no EU citizenship and no problems whatsoever. (Of course these rules apply to all non-EU citizens.) Please don't hold me responsible if any of the following changes with time! (With your help we can keep this info up-to-date).

One: You can work!
If you turn up in Spain without a work visa, you will find work, mostly English teaching, bar work and maybe tour guiding. Employers in these fields are prepared to pay non-EU nationals - in cash. But don’t worry, you can open a bank account in Spain with no trouble at all.

Bigger cities will have more work opportunities, so if in doubt start with Barcelona or Madrid.

Two: The return ticket.
Arriving at a Spanish airport from the US with no return ticket is likely to be an expensive mistake. You will probably be forced to buy one there and then, in the airport, at a hugely increased price. You may be able to get a refund afterwards though, so it might not be the end of the world.

Three: The 90 day rule.
In theory your entry visa is good for 90 days, but don’t worry, if you spend longer in Spain you will not be thrown into jail or banned from coming back when you try to leave. Just have an excuse handy (”My Spanish studies lasted longer than I had anticipated…”, for example…)

Four: Spending.
Don’t turn up with travelers cheques, they are a pain to convert into cash. Just your regular cashpoint card is fine. Match the symbols on the back with those on Spanish cashpoints if you get confused! (Is ‘cashpoint’ only British English? ATM’s then…) And be prepared to spend. The dollar is better than it was but many a traveler arrives in Spain expecting the cheap country it once was. Times have changed…

---------

Any further info on American citizens working in Spain with or without a visa, comments, suggestions, criticisms or refutations, are welcome below:

Dan 6th October 2006 12:09 AM

Age Factor
 
How old is too old to work in Spain? In Central and South America you are considered too old to work at 35.

Ben 6th October 2006 12:35 AM

I would say that here the answer would be the same for the UK or the states.

Cynthia 6th October 2006 02:47 AM

You're making it far too easy for me to "miss my flight" back home when I visit Spain! ;)

(PS I do think "cashpoint" is a British term. Thanks for clarifying that it's an ATM, though--I got worried for a split-second because I didn't have one of these things!)

Viajero26 4th January 2007 07:14 PM

New Hope
 
I visited Spain for a couple of weeks last year and absolutely fell in love with it. Since then I've been trying to find ways to get back to Spain- and stay. For a while I was quite discouraged when reading about the ability of North Americans to be employed in Spain, but this forum has definitely reinvigorated my desire to return to Spain. Thanks for the advice!
PS- The podcast is amazing, Ben & Marina- keep it up!

Edith 5th January 2007 07:49 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dan (Post 9287)
How old is too old to work in Spain? In Central and South America you are considered too old to work at 35.

:eek:

But too young to apply for a pension! :rolleyes:

richardksa 5th January 2007 08:03 AM

Ten years ago I was turned down for a job in Europe as I was too old at 46. They never hired above 35 I was told. But they also needed 12 years experience and the ability to speak French!!! Within a week though, I had got my present job here in Saudi and found I was working for a company part-owned by the company that had turned me down. Suddenly we had a lot of young engineers sent to us for training. There's a moral there somewhere.

Viajero26 11th January 2007 11:23 PM

Cuanto cuesta?
 
I noticed in your initial post that you advised to be prepared to spend. While I know that the cost of living in Madrid can be relatively high, I was wondering exactly what numbers you could come up with for someone who was thinking about traveling to and staying in Madrid. Does a job search last very long (for someone wanting to teach English) and is it very expensive?

acmench 12th January 2007 09:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Viajero26 (Post 15187)
Does a job search last very long (for someone wanting to teach English) and is it very expensive?

Hi, Viajero,

I can't speak about the cost of living in Spain, now as I lived there a little over 3 years ago. However, I did work for 2 years as a "all cash" English teacher. :)

Regarding the job search, simply finding a job in Madrid was fairly easy. The best places to look for job listings are the Spanish newspapers and a pretty popular English language magazine, In Madrid. http://in-madrid.com/class.html It's also an okay resource for finding rentals, flatmates, etc. You can also just look up language academies in the phone book and give them a call to see if they're hiring. In my experience there's fairly high turnover, particularly among the academies that hire Americans. There are a number of schools (some of the best, in fact) that won't hire you without papers. But there also PLENTY that have no problem hiring Americans (or Canadiens, Australians, etc) and some even prefer to.

One thing to keep in mind is that a lot of academies don't have their normal arsenal of teachers and classes during the summer. A lot of students choose to take that time off. If you are hoping to work in the summer, a good option is to find a job at an English summer camp. There seem to be a lot of those, although I never did it myself.

I would say you should put together a resume, include your picture, and, once you get there, start calling around. Good luck!!

MateoB678 22nd January 2007 10:19 AM

Hello, I'm new to this site and I simply love it all, the podcasts and the forums. Great Work!!!;D

I had a quick question about teaching english. I plan to move to Spain in March and will need some income fairly soon after I arrive. My question: is it worth the investment of time and money to take a course to get your TESOL certificate, or would I be able to find a job right away without any certifications. I've seen some websites that offer the course and help find you a job after completing the course. Any tips or experiences or information would be greatly appreciated!!!!;D

Thanks,
Matt

melissinda 22nd January 2007 06:48 PM

i am brand new to the forum and to the podcasts, but i can't get enough of them! The moment i hear the sweet sound of the madrilenan accent i nearly cried! :blush: I spent this past year in madrid studying at Complutense, and as seems to be a popular response, fell absolutely in love with it. They had to force me on the plane to go home. :p

As i graduate from college this coming may it is of course on my mind to find a way back to spain, even for a brief time (brief being a few years!) i met many people, even some americans, who teach english in madrid and have for years, however... they all somehow have EU passports, this of course was discouraging as i have nothing of the kind.
I have a few questions about what Ben posted... if you enter the country they know if you have bought a one way ticket? and they will make you buy your return ticket on the spot?

if i was to go over and teach english without papers, and i didn't leave the country until a few years later, will they question why i was there for x number of years? the excuse that my studies went on longer seems like it might not hold up in that instance.

is it possible to get working papers through an english school, if they hire you, will they help you get your papers? or do you need them before you even apply?

also, is an international company such as starbucks an option. is it possible, if you work at a starbucks in the states to request a transfer in other countries?

sorry, so many questions! Thank you again!

acmench 22nd January 2007 08:50 PM

Hey, Melissinda,

I know how you feel about loving Madrid and wanting to get back there. I lived there for 2 years and have been away for about 3 1/2. My husband (a Madrileño I met while there) and I are moving back over there in April. I CANNOT wait!!! Anyway, here's my insight into being an American working in Spain...

Quote:

Originally Posted by melissinda (Post 15938)
i met many people, even some americans, who teach english in madrid and have for years, however... they all somehow have EU passports, this of course was discouraging as i have nothing of the kind.
I have a few questions about what Ben posted... if you enter the country they know if you have bought a one way ticket? and they will make you buy your return ticket on the spot?

I lived in Spain for 2 years and didn't have an EU passport. I left and re-entered Spain from the US probably 5 times and re-entered from elsewhere in Europe another 4 times or so. I was never asked to show a return ticket when entering the country. In all likelihood when you are first entering from the States you'll have a return ticket anyway; it's much cheaper to buy them that way.

Quote:

Originally Posted by melissinda (Post 15938)
if i was to go over and teach english without papers, and i didn't leave the country until a few years later, will they question why i was there for x number of years? the excuse that my studies went on longer seems like it might not hold up in that instance.

I was asked once when leaving the country why I had a return ticket to Spain. I fed them the line about roundtrip tickets being cheaper and they were satisfied with that. In my experience the Guardia Civil working the passport booth at the airport took about 3 seconds to glance at the picture and then turned to the next empty page for the stamp.

Quote:

Originally Posted by melissinda (Post 15938)
is it possible to get working papers through an english school, if they hire you, will they help you get your papers? or do you need them before you even apply?

I worked for 3 different academies and none were willing to help with papers. I've heard that occasionally they will but I think it's mostly for teachers they've employed for years.

Quote:

Originally Posted by melissinda (Post 15938)
also, is an international company such as starbucks an option. is it possible, if you work at a starbucks in the states to request a transfer in other countries?

While there I taught English to an executive at Shell Oil. Being a civil engineer and an American, I thought it possible they'd have a position for me. My student asked around but was told that hiring undocumented Americans is low on the list. They must first offer the job to Spanish citizens and residents, then to EU citizens, and then to outside foreigners. That's not to say that a company wouldn't transfer you, but I don't see it being overly likely.

Hope this helps and good luck!!!
Amy

melissinda 23rd January 2007 05:30 AM

Amy,
thank you so much for all that information! ;D It helped a great deal! It is always nice to know that it IS possible, as difficult and frustrating as the process may be, it is a possibility. One which i must pursue asap! thank you again!

melissa

ogando 30th January 2007 03:05 PM

over 35
 
What happens to people who are over 35?
Are they forced to wear black and sit in parks feeding the pigeons.
We must be working somewhere.

Acosta 9th February 2007 02:59 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dan (Post 9287)
How old is too old to work in Spain? In Central and South America you are considered too old to work at 35.

So what does one do with the other 35 to 45 years of their life, in those areas?

sandy 2nd March 2007 10:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by melissinda (Post 15938)
is it possible to get working papers through an english school, if they hire you, will they help you get your papers? or do you need them before you even apply?

My experience is from many years ago but I am quite sure the regulations have not changed much. You need to have an offer letter from your employer before you can even apply. Once you get the offer letter, you need to have get a medical exam, a local police clearance, fill out some forms and go to the Spanish consulate to apply for an entrance visa. That will take a few months at least. Once it is approved, they will notify you at an American address since you are not supposed to be working in Spain yet.

Once you get the visa, which is a sticker in your passport, you can then go to Spain, to apply for the working permit. You have 30 days to do it. The working permit will take another few months. Whether you can work in the meantime is in the grey area. I was told even I didn't have a working permit yet, I could start working. But then you have to sort out how your employer pays you until you get the proper documentation.

Conclusion, it takes a long time to get the working permit, and the application starts with the Spanish Consulate before you come. If you want to do everything legally, find an employer early.

In any case, I was told that the Spanish government keeps an eye closed when it comes to people holding an American passports. Don't quote me on that.

Someone (sorry I forgot the name) has already posted that you will not normally be asked to show your return ticket when you enter the country. I never had to do it in any country as a matter of fact.

sandy
-------------
www.excelwines.com

MonikaD. 7th March 2007 10:21 PM

Hola all!

Seriously thinking of moving to Spain, I'm concerned about job opportunities for English teachers who are not native speakers of this language (like myself :)). Obviously, we can hardly compete with you guys, but do we stand a chance?

eazyebeneezer 8th March 2007 12:21 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MonikaD. (Post 19156)
Hola all!

Seriously thinking of moving to Spain, I'm concerned about job opportunities for English teachers who are not native speakers of this language (like myself :)). Obviously, we can hardly compete with you guys, but do we stand a chance?

TEFL certification will definitely help. that's your calling card and proof of not only linguistic, but teaching qualifications. sometimes non-native speakers make better teachers, having already learned the language themselves. and judging from your three lines, you have no issues with english :)

Damian Corrigan 8th March 2007 12:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ben (Post 9240)
you will find work ... maybe tour guiding



I'd be careful with this - tour guides need to be officially certified (and you'll need to be legal to get this). If you try working this way, you'll be breaking the law in two ways. Especially in Madrid, police/trading standards officers grab people who look like they are giving guided tours and ask to see your ID. If you are working illegally, you ought to keep your head down a little, so running guided tours is a dangerous thing to do.

I've also heard that bars are clamping down on illegal works - again, they're quite visual. Teaching is easier, but even then, I've found schools have rejected US teachers for academy work, because, again, they're easily caught - they prefer to send them to business classes, because no one is going to be checking 8am classes! But Madrid and Barcelona are packed with US citizens teaching illegally, so don't worry, you'll find work - I'd say only a third would turn you down. But a TEFL qualification will aid you more than a legal citizen - they're more likely to stick their neck out and hire you if they at least know you're qualified - taking an illegal AND unqualified/inexperienced teacher is a little risky and the school would need to be quite desperate to do so - thankfully, many schools ARE desperate!

Damian

RojiBlanco34 9th April 2007 06:32 PM

is there a reason that nobody has mentioned other jobs such as Cafés, or cervercerías, etc? are those type of jobs untouchable?

Spanish people 31st May 2007 03:35 PM

damian in affraid you are wrong
 
It depends on the city, but official guides are very few and the tourism market is so big, running guided tours is NOT a dangerous thing to do.

tierra-de-olas 31st May 2007 05:16 PM

DELE?
 
I thought anyone who wanted to officially work in Spain needed to take and pass the DELE, the Spanish equivalent of the TOEFL?

DCkid 7th June 2007 10:51 AM

Here´s my 2 cents on this.

Bar work is usually found in the more touristic areas such as Benidorm, Marbella etc. My father owns a place in Marberlla, but usually hires Argentinians, when they are not complaining. Expect to be explioted. No matter what your always going to find an employer taking advantage of your situation here. I can´t even tell how many people I known that have had falling outs with "friends" hiring them for bar work. Business is business

Best Advice is to prep from the States. If your looking for a job, before getting over here try www.infojobs.net all 3 jobs I found here in Spain working for large multinationals I got through that site. If you type english in the search you will find tons of work. Send resumes´s explain your situation. If your good they might take the chance. So sell yourself :)

Hope this helps

meghan 20th June 2007 05:41 AM

Internships
 
hey all! I am planning to move to Madrid in September and was wondering if anyone knows or has heard of anyone that has applied for an internship in Spain from overseas. Two agencies, Instituto Hemingway and BEST Programs, offer (for a fee) to find housing and an internship in a specified field in addition to language classes, an orientation, etc. I have not heard much about how accredited these organizations are or how likely it is that I would be able to find a decent internship, but if any of you have suggestions, please let me know. I am actually looking to work in the art world in some capacity (a museum or gallery) but because I don't have much experience, I was thinking of looking for an internship first. Thanks! Any leads or help would be greatly appreciated! -meghan

Beckett 22nd June 2007 10:49 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by meghan (Post 27462)
hey all! I am planning to move to Madrid in September and was wondering if anyone knows or has heard of anyone that has applied for an internship in Spain from overseas. Two agencies, Instituto Hemingway and BEST Programs, offer (for a fee) to find housing and an internship in a specified field in addition to language classes, an orientation, etc. I have not heard much about how accredited these organizations are or how likely it is that I would be able to find a decent internship, but if any of you have suggestions, please let me know. I am actually looking to work in the art world in some capacity (a museum or gallery) but because I don't have much experience, I was thinking of looking for an internship first. Thanks! Any leads or help would be greatly appreciated! -meghan

Meghan,
Save your money. You would be better off contacting galleries in Madrid on your own and offering your services to volunteer there. I assume that you're willing to work for free, right? In Spain, the paid internship doesn't exist and there is a lot of exploitation in the labor market.

ryanjames 6th July 2007 01:44 AM

please help!!
 
hello
i have been living and working in spain
without papers for about 5 months now.
i must return to the states for a family
emergency, but i want to come back
to finish working.

if i leave spain and stay a week or 2 in the US, will i be able to re-enter spain
without a problem
thanks
rj

Beckett 6th July 2007 11:41 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ryanjames (Post 28359)
hello
i have been living and working in spain
without papers for about 5 months now.
i must return to the states for a family
emergency, but i want to come back
to finish working.

if i leave spain and stay a week or 2 in the US, will i be able to re-enter spain
without a problem
thanks
rj

Technically, you've overstayed, but whether or not you get stopped at the airport will depend on whether the airline and/or the Spanish Guardia Civil at the Spanish airport you fly into take a closer look at your passport and decide to stop you. It can go either way.

ryanjames 6th July 2007 06:54 PM

so what happens if i get stoped,
and it would be better to fly into a larger airport then

Kevin Salami 12th August 2007 11:53 AM

Could you help me out on these questions?

1)I am moving to Madrid Spain. The employer told me that the income tax on 100,000 Euro is around %45! Is it true? the government take half of the money that we make there?
2)how much is the rent for a 3 bed 2 bath middle class family in Madrid?
3)what is the living expenses for a 2 adults and a baby there?
4)can I bring my car over from U.S?

I appreciated for your time.
Kevin

Beckett 12th August 2007 12:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kevin Salami (Post 30514)
Could you help me out on these questions?

1)I am moving to Madrid Spain. The employer told me that the income tax on 100,000 Euro is around %45! Is it true? the government take half of the money that we make there?
2)how much is the rent for a 3 bed 2 bath middle class family in Madrid?
3)what is the living expenses for a 2 adults and a baby there?
4)can I bring my car over from U.S?

I appreciated for your time.
Kevin

Congrats on your new job! Yes, taxes are much higher in Europe but don't worry. You're receiving an excellent salary. An annual salary of 100,000€ probably puts you in the top 10% of wage-earners in Spain. Regarding your car, depends on the make and model. Cars in Spain tend to be rather small, in comparison to the average vehicle in the U.S. Gas prices are higher and parking is hard to come by in the city and would be impossible to deal with if you're driving a SUV or some other large vehicle.

Regarding housing costs: www.idealista.com
Also, worth a look: www.SpainExpat.com. They have a category on moving to Spain as well as access to cost of living calculators.

http://www.spainexpat.com/spain/info...ving_in_spain/

Good luck!

Beckett 12th August 2007 12:49 PM

Another thing...I assume that your new employer will assist you with relocating from the U.S. A talk with their relocation service or somebody in their HR dept should also be able to answer some of these questions. ¡Suerte!

meghan 1st September 2007 11:49 PM

ID card
 
Hello to everyone. To all of you who have replied from Spain (or who lived in Spain), your advice has been particularly helpful, and I'm so grateful! Of course thanks to Ben and Marina for the podcast and website- its awesome and much needed! On one of the "Notes From Spain" podcasts, on living in Spain I guess, I think ya'll (Ben and Marina) mentioned the importance of an ID card for doing a lot of different things in Spain. I am from the US and am moving in about 3 weeks to Madrid to work in the education department at the Museo del Prado for basically a 3-month internship (that I hope to extend!). According to the company I applied through who has found housing for me, I do not need any sort of visa for this- just my passport (as a "tourist" i guess). I'm a little worried about this/confused and am wondering what the visa for residency actually entails. Furthermore, pertaining to my first issue, will I literally HAVE to (theoretically) obtain an ID card to be able to use my credit card- I guess I can answer that because I assume for "tourists" or those without a visa, one just shoes his/her passport as ID. Can you see any reason I would HAVE to have an ID card for the next few months if I will be working as an intern (maybe earning a stipend) and (hopefully) working (illegally, I guess) as an English tutor/teacher? Thanks again for your help and for everyone's comments. I'd appreciate any advice/suggestions!

Beckett 2nd September 2007 02:11 PM

Hi Meghan,
Welcome to the forum! Regarding the ID card you mentioned, it's called the "tarjeta de extranjero" or the NIE. Unfortunately, as a U.S. citizen you will not be able to get this card without a valid visa issued by the Spanish consulate. You can go here for more info: http://www.maec.es/consulados/nuevayork/es/home

That web site is for the NYC Spanish consulate. You can search on Google for the Spanish consulate closest to where you live.

By the way, the NIE is not a work visa/work permit. That is a separate document.

If you don't have a NIE, you can use your passport as identification when using your credit card. By the way, make sure to make a photocopy of your passport AND be sure to register online with the U.S. Embassy in Madrid. That way if your passport ever gets lost or stolen (God forbid), or something happens to you while in Spain, all of your information will already be in the system, expediting any request you may need to make.
U.S. citizens are allowed to stay in Spain for up to 90 days without a visa.

Good luck!
beckett

holaquétal 4th September 2007 02:01 AM

re- americans working in spain
 
Hello everyone - I just joined the forum and I am really hoping that you guys have some answers for me because I have been searching the web for hours to no avail. It is really hard to find info regarding work.

Okay here is the deal - I am an eeuu citizen in spain on a student visa for 9 months and I really want to find part-time work in the restaurant sector - I don´t really care in what aspect - kitchen, front of house, whatever... I really don´t care about the money or the exploitation - i just think it would be good for my spanish and my psyche and yes, even my wallet a little bit. So I guess my question is...is this legal? I have seen conflicting explanations. It seems that maybe I can work part-time if it doesn´t conflict with my studies?? (but can´t seem to find any specific info to support that) Or if it is ilegal - is it possible and how? Would I get deported, as some say? (that seems highly unlikely if you ask me, but than why do they say it?) Can I just walk into a bar that has a sign up and ask? Also what does it mean when they want ¨documentación en regla¨ - can i fill out that documentation? Well, I guess you get the gist for now. Please respond - if working is a really bad idea I need to know now so I can move on and stop wondering. Thanks!!!!

holaquétal 4th September 2007 02:05 AM

So, if one has the student visa, can you explain how to get the nie card. I need to do that too. Thanks!

Eve 5th November 2007 09:38 PM

Hi there, I'm a New Zealander, so I assume the same rules apply to me as Americans?

I'm heading over to Spain next year to do my CELTA course and then teach English (hopefully!) and what i'm wanting to know is whether I should apply for a Spanish student Visa for this?? Or do I just come into the country as a tourist and then sort the 90 day issue out later once I have a job.

If anyone can shed some light on this I'd be most grateful! thanks!

greytop 6th November 2007 01:43 PM

I came across this site (spainlawyer.com) that has info on studying/living/working in Spain. Check internet sources though as they may be out of date & don't come with guarantees!
I hope it helps somebody!

virgeved 2nd February 2008 02:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by holaquétal (Post 32029)
Hello everyone - I just joined the forum and I am really hoping that you guys have some answers for me because I have been searching the web for hours to no avail. It is really hard to find info regarding work.

Okay here is the deal - I am an eeuu citizen in spain on a student visa for 9 months and I really want to find part-time work in the restaurant sector - I don´t really care in what aspect - kitchen, front of house, whatever... I really don´t care about the money or the exploitation - i just think it would be good for my spanish and my psyche and yes, even my wallet a little bit. So I guess my question is...is this legal? I have seen conflicting explanations. It seems that maybe I can work part-time if it doesn´t conflict with my studies?? (but can´t seem to find any specific info to support that) Or if it is ilegal - is it possible and how? Would I get deported, as some say? (that seems highly unlikely if you ask me, but than why do they say it?) Can I just walk into a bar that has a sign up and ask? Also what does it mean when they want ¨documentación en regla¨ - can i fill out that documentation? Well, I guess you get the gist for now. Please respond - if working is a really bad idea I need to know now so I can move on and stop wondering. Thanks!!!!

A student visa en Spain allows you to work a maximum of 20 hours a week, in a job that does not conflict with your school schedule. for example if you have class in the afternoon you can only work mornings. You need to go to the police station in the town you are living...first apply for the NIE card with your visa, this might take up to 3 or 4 months, but they will give you a paper that you can use the same as the card, and once you have the card, or resguardo of the card you can apply for the work permit.

once you have the permit to work, alot of times employers will let you work more than the 20 hours alotted (off the record)

Good luck!

greytop 14th February 2008 11:37 AM

low paid workers - boss arrested
 
If you're thinking of earning a bit outside the system this may be of interest.
From other posts & news items about the sub-1000 € per month workers, they weren't being paid that much less than legal workers although the hours were longer. Interesting to know what the agricultural workers pick up!
Unfortunately there is no follow up as to what they are supposed to do now, presumably without any income at all.

Immigrants forced to work 55-hour week for EUR 230 wage 13/02/2008 00:00

The owner of a restaurant in Bilbao has been detained by police after it emerged that he was forcing his illegal immigrant staff to work 55-hour weeks for a salary of EUR 230.

katya 22nd March 2008 05:27 PM

visa question
 
Hi all,
I am in Barcelona and have been here for a week now. It's March and so my 90 days will be up at the beginning of June. I'd like to stay here at least through the summer. I'm in a Spanish school and only enrolled for two months.

1)If I extend my studies in the school through the summer, can I get a Student Visa while I'm already in Spain? Or do I have to go home to Boston's Spanish Consulate?

2)The 90 day rule applies to the EU, no? If you are in Spain for 90 days, you have to leave the EU for 90 days until you can come back? Or can you go to another country in the EU, say France?

Thanks for your help!
-Katya


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