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Old 12th August 2008, 05:09 AM   #1
dave
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Default yikes, Spanish Olympic basketball teams exhibited extremely poor judgement.....

This made me cringe. Alot.

http://www.guardian.co.uk/sport/2008....olympics20081

Please, someone tell me this isn't what the article claims it is. (Though, what else could it be??)

Did anyone see the ad?
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Old 12th August 2008, 12:09 PM   #2
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This made me cringe. Alot.

http://www.guardian.co.uk/sport/2008....olympics20081

Please, someone tell me this isn't what the article claims it is. (Though, what else could it be??)

Did anyone see the ad?
Unbelivable! I just don't get this lack of awareness!
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Old 12th August 2008, 06:44 PM   #3
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That's amazingly stupid.
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Old 18th August 2008, 11:07 AM   #4
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That's something that a bunch of high schoolers MIGHT do not a bunch of world class atheletes and a big company and an advertising agency and...and...and...

Somebody somewhere would have had to have said "you guys think this is really a good idea?"
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Old 18th August 2008, 08:14 PM   #5
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maybe I make a mistake but why there are allways english periodists attacking spain with the smallest nonsense thing they can find?
 
Old 18th August 2008, 09:18 PM   #6
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maybe I make a mistake but why there are allways english periodists attacking spain with the smallest nonsense thing they can find?
This isn't that small.
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Old 18th August 2008, 10:48 PM   #7
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nobody has complained about the photo (even in china) but UK newspapers so...

http://www.as.com/baloncesto/articul...asdaibal_1/Tes
 
Old 19th August 2008, 12:01 AM   #8
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Originally Posted by ArualyEgroj View Post
nobody has complained about the photo (even in china) but UK newspapers so...

http://www.as.com/baloncesto/articul...asdaibal_1/Tes
Don't be so sure.

Last edited by ValenciaSon; 19th August 2008 at 12:15 AM.
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Old 19th August 2008, 05:19 PM   #9
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http://www.justlanded.com/espanol/Re...and-Pakistanis
 
Old 19th August 2008, 05:24 PM   #10
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and more...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XVSvp5JJO4s
 
Old 19th August 2008, 05:27 PM   #11
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and more...

http://www.indymedia.org.uk/en/2008/08/406817.html
 
Old 19th August 2008, 05:39 PM   #12
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there was just a bit, and if I do the same in google with "USA racism" I never finish.

and I sorry about all of this, just wanted to show that "nadie esta libre de pecado"
and there are worst things in our/your countries to complain than a stupid photo.

such a pitty.
 
Old 19th August 2008, 05:55 PM   #13
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I don't think anyone denies that there is racism in the UK and the US. The difference seems to be that there are also a lot of people from those countries who condemn it...without reservations....without pointing the finger at other countries and saying "they are worse than we are"....without constantly looking for excuses....and without playing the victim. It's a detail, but an important one.
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Old 19th August 2008, 06:37 PM   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ArualyEgroj View Post
there was just a bit, and if I do the same in google with "USA racism" I never finish.

and I sorry about all of this, just wanted to show that "nadie esta libre de pecado"
and there are worst things in our/your countries to complain than a stupid photo.

such a pitty.
You are correct in pointing out that racism exists in the UK and the US, which is why it is important that the media in those countries tries to expose it, so we can reflect on it and try to improve the situation.

However in Spain the media appears to be in a state of denial that certain racial gestures might be found offensive. It's like they are saying "hey, in our culture this is not offensive, so we'll keep on doing it". Now I know that the Spanish don't find it offensive, and it was probably an innocent mistake. However, can you not see that the Chinese might find this offensive? Can you not see that when the Spanish kids go back to school next month that they will all be making slit-eyed expressions to the Chinese kids? Can you not see that if you are the only Chinese kid in a class of 30 and everybody is pointing out how different you are to them then you might feel a bit lonely, isolated, depressed even?

If Spain wants an integrated society then I can't see how such behaviour helps.

I've kept out of this topic so far, but on Sunday I saw two television presenters (on "el cuarto") ridiculing the idea that the gesture might be offensive and they started making slit-eyes themselves, as if to prove a point. On live national television. This was then followed by some footage of people in the street saying how making such an expression is not offensive...

However they did not even ask one single Asian person about what they thought!

It seems that if it doesn't cause offense to the Spanish then that is all that matters.

I believe the root of the problem lies with the Spanish media. There is very little investigative journalism, debate, or any kind of awkward questioning taking place. Foreign countries look to the Spanish media as a reflection of Spanish public opinion. However if the topic of interest might reflect badly on Spain, the media collectively becomes defensive. Nobody stands up and says "hey guys, that might have been a bad idea!" Instead it is portrayed as the Anglos picking on the Spanish, maybe to divert attention from how feeble the Spanish media currently is.
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Old 19th August 2008, 07:11 PM   #15
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Un aplauso, Legazpi! Very well said.

At the rate that Spain is going, it should be ready for the Olympics by the year 2040. Spain should forget about even bothering to submit a bid for the 2016 Olympics if it insists on being, as a society, so insultingly dismissive about issues related to race, ethnicity and cultural differences.

Quote:
Originally Posted by ;59260
there was just a bit, and if I do the same in google with "USA racism" I never finish.

and I sorry about all of this, just wanted to show that "nadie esta libre de pecado"
and there are worst things in our/your countries to complain than a stupid photo.

such a pitty.
To: ArualyEgroj (and, by extension, all the other Spaniards out there who don't think Spain has a ticking time bomb on its hands when it comes to race and xenophobia and keep pointing at the U.S. and the U.K. as even worse examples than Spain.)

Let me give you an analogy. Let's say that you and are in a parking lot. Our cars are parked next to one another. While getting into my car, I notice that one of my tires is flat. I get a jack and a spare tire out of my car and begin to change it. As I roll up my sleeves and squat down, I just so happen to notice that one of the tires on YOUR car is also flat. So I yell, "Hey, Aru!" -(and I call you "Aru" because no tengo ni idea how to pronounce "ArualyEgroj")- "Don't drive anywhere because one of your tires is flat. You better fix it before you go on the road."

Instead of checking out your tires, you look at me with a sneer and say mockingly, "Oh, yeah? Well, what about your car, tronco? You've got a flat tire too and I don't see you driving anywhere on it!"

I look at you, exasperated, and I reply, "Yes, I know I've got a flat tire! Can you not see me squatting here, on the ground, with a tire iron in my fist? What do you think I'm doing down here? Having a picnic?!!"

And you respond, "Well what gives YOU the right to tell ME that I've got a flat tire! I don't have to listen to you! I know my car! And my car would NEVER EVER IN A MILLION YEARS HAVE A FLAT TIRE!!"

And with that, I shake my head, turn around and finish changing the flat tire on my car. It takes longer than I expected, but I finally get the spare tire on. I drive the car out of the parking lot and I'm motoring along the highway when I come across an accident. I slow down to see what's going on. Whadda ya know, it's your car. Your tire totally blew out causing your car to spin out of control and hit some other cars on the highway.

An accident that could've been prevented was not due to the state of denial you were in.

Last edited by Beckett; 19th August 2008 at 07:26 PM.
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Old 20th August 2008, 12:01 AM   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Beckett View Post
and I call you "Aru" because no tengo ni idea how to pronounce "ArualyEgroj")
Try reading it backwards and splitting it into three.
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Old 20th August 2008, 12:39 AM   #17
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Cual eres, Jorge o Laura?
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Old 20th August 2008, 06:41 AM   #18
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Bravo Beckett! Great analogy.

Just because we are still trying to take the plank out of our eye, doesn't mean that the splinter in yours doesn't need attention.
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Old 20th August 2008, 08:36 AM   #19
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In a few years we will have a generation, who have never lived without “the world wide web” and as the years pass it becomes increasingly obvious that more and more users become more ingrained in the thought that the world's moral,social, racial mores and much more are in turn globaly standardised throught this new small web village. Despite this; the nations of this relatively vast planet remain diverse, distinct and from your own corner perhaps at times very curious, different and confusing.


No country that I know of has it's house in order in matters of racism and no country has a perfect racial code that should be held as an example for all countries to follow. Fortunately the world is too diverse and complicated to allow such an easy solution. Perhaps in the distant future as humans evolve this may become possible.


It is true to say that in modern times Spain is entering a new era where it's racial tolerance will be tested and exposed and Spain can learn from other countries recent handling of racism. In return critics could try to “educate” Spain with a less pious, judgemental and condescending approach free from any other agenda than that of helping the Spanish people to become more aware of the elements of beneficial, positive “racial awareness ” within other countries .
But as many forums show, in general, the critics themselves whilst seeking global racial harmony fail to deliver on that educational challenge.

Within that lies a profound responsibility for professional commentators ( and perhaps all public posters?) to report an informative, balanced and educational stance. This however is often not achieved and leads in turn to a fractured, divisive and closed mindset and shackles the understanding of another culture.

The journalist who wrote the original article had been given 300 words of press space. Despite living and working in Spain for some years the author included no reference to social/cultural differences in Spain ( which he surely is aware of) that have a relevance to the global understanding of the story. If he needed 600 words to convey this, he should have demanded it or not written the article. Such is the new journalist responsibility in our small global web village.

Will Spain be ready to host the Olympic Games by 2040? Has any previous host been ready to host and be on solid ground on this issue?

And like the original article, is that question agenda free or just a personal human thought? I hope the second, but it is clear that such questions cloud the original issue and often flame the “secondary agenda debate” and undermine attempts at building understanding.
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Old 20th August 2008, 11:50 AM   #20
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Sometimes the truth an be told in 300 words or less and can come from any corner of the world because if the web village reveals anything, it is that we are more similar than disimilar and should stop persisting to exist in silos.
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