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Old 2nd June 2010, 11:33 PM   #81
Acosta
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Just watching the news... it seems the days of smoking in public places are numbered in Spain. I can't wait!!

They say it will become law in January 2011, from what I understood.
And will that law be obeyed?
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Old 2nd June 2010, 11:58 PM   #82
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And will that law be obeyed?
Citations can be a source of much needed revenue.
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Old 3rd June 2010, 07:50 PM   #83
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Just watching the news... it seems the days of smoking in public places are numbered in Spain. I can't wait!!

They say it will become law in January 2011, from what I understood.
I thought from reading on here smoking already is banned but the law isn't enforced. Is this the We Won't Tell You Again, We Really Mean It This Time law?
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Old 4th June 2010, 07:36 AM   #84
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I thought from reading on here smoking already is banned but the law isn't enforced. Is this the We Won't Tell You Again, We Really Mean It This Time law?
The law was watered down locally by the autonomous regions to some extent. Here (Valencian region) it is optional for small bars (<100 sq m?) which effectively means they nearly all allow it or go bust. Smoking areas could also be set up with "physical" barriers between the smokers and non-smokers, rather loosely interpreted though.
There are probably some exceptions but most public buildings and offices do seem to be non-smoking already. I guess it is harder to know if private offices conform unless someone complains.
Although I know the risks and don´t like the smell, I can still sympathise to some extent with people on a night out or just having a coffee break who need their "fix". Seems a pity we can´t find a solution (other than standing outside like naughty schoolboys) that gives everyone a choice.

Last edited by greytop; 4th June 2010 at 08:20 AM. Reason: typo
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Old 4th June 2010, 08:01 AM   #85
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Piffle. We've been going without in many parts of the US for years. And I remember when everyone was in hysterics about it, crying that the bars would all close, people would lose money and go out of business and have to beg in the streets -- it didn't happen. People just go outside to smoke between drinks the same way they go outside on breaks at work, and no one is hungry and destitute because of it. There was a lot of whining and complaining, but then people adjusted, and now no one thinks twice about it.
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Old 4th June 2010, 08:47 AM   #86
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Originally Posted by Gem View Post
Just watching the news... it seems the days of smoking in public places are numbered in Spain. I can't wait!!

They say it will become law in January 2011, from what I understood.
Yes, you are right, I believe 1 January 2011 will be the date that the new law takes effect. However, it will be very interesting to see how long and to what extent, the authorities will take to enforce the law.
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Old 11th June 2010, 07:50 AM   #87
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http://news.ph.msn.com/lifestyle/art...mentid=4125899 >> check the link for the latest news guys... smoking ban on some places in Spain will be extended until next year. Oh well, good luck for the smokers I guess. =)
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Old 11th June 2010, 12:45 PM   #88
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http://news.ph.msn.com/lifestyle/art...mentid=4125899 >> check the link for the latest news guys... smoking ban on some places in Spain will be extended until next year. Oh well, good luck for the smokers I guess. =)
Bad luck for those with lungs.
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Old 13th June 2010, 08:08 PM   #89
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Originally Posted by Uriel View Post
Piffle. We've been going without in many parts of the US for years. And I remember when everyone was in hysterics about it, crying that the bars would all close, people would lose money and go out of business and have to beg in the streets -- it didn't happen. People just go outside to smoke between drinks the same way they go outside on breaks at work, and no one is hungry and destitute because of it. There was a lot of whining and complaining, but then people adjusted, and now no one thinks twice about it.
Your argument and using the US as an example does not work for me. Here in Spain bars are also used as coffee/vending machines, as hardly any office has one. This simply means that bars in Spain get more income from the Spanish workers than the bars in the US, from American workers. When a Spaniard has a break (which every one under EU rules is entitled too) he/she pops to the bar next door. These are the businesses that are going to suffer.


What I don’t understand is everyone one who is against smoking writes as if the banning of smoking is going to provide some miracle health cure. It is not. Contamination from industry, cars and planes etc pose a greater health hazard.


Another thing that is never explained by the anti-smoking groups is; if smoking is stopped, then how would the government fill the coffers with the hole left by revenue gained by taxing the smoker.
I write this as a non-smoker.
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Old 13th June 2010, 08:30 PM   #90
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Lack of tobacco revenue will be offset by lack of healthcare costs related to emphysema, lung cancer and secondary illness.
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Old 13th June 2010, 08:38 PM   #91
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It may not be the same situation exactly, but businesspeople everywhere are wily and creative, and above all they want to stay in business. I imagine Spanish bars will adjust eventually. All businesses go through a change in model as they react to changes in regulations, shopping patterns, the economic environment, market whims, and other vagaries of life. That's just survival -- if you're not going to make the same amount of money on one thing or in one way, you shift your focus to something else. I would imagine that people will still pop in for their coffee and snacks, and the bars will find a new way to capitalize on that ingrained behavior. Something similar happened to gas stations in the US when pay-at-the-pump cardswipes became common -- they started to lose tons of revenue generated from purchases of gum and candy bars and chips and drinks and whatever else that people used to buy as they paid at the counter. So they started advertising outside and allocating their income generation a little differently so they weren't so reliant on impulse purchasing.
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Old 13th June 2010, 11:42 PM   #92
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Originally Posted by ribeirasacra View Post
Your argument and using the US as an example does not work for me. Here in Spain bars are also used as coffee/vending machines, as hardly any office has one. This simply means that bars in Spain get more income from the Spanish workers than the bars in the US, from American workers. When a Spaniard has a break (which every one under EU rules is entitled too) he/she pops to the bar next door. These are the businesses that are going to suffer.
Are you suggesting Spaniards will stop going for a coffee break because they can't smoke in bars? I'm sure you'll find they'll still take their coffee break in the bar next door, and a quick cigerette in the street.

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What I don’t understand is everyone one who is against smoking writes as if the banning of smoking is going to provide some miracle health cure. It is not. Contamination from industry, cars and planes etc pose a greater health hazard.
I can't think of anyone who has written that banning smoking will provide a miracle health cure.

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Originally Posted by ribeirasacra View Post
Another thing that is never explained by the anti-smoking groups is; if smoking is stopped, then how would the government fill the coffers with the hole left by revenue gained by taxing the smoker.
I write this as a non-smoker.
Indeed there is a financial argument to keep people smoking. In fact why not go the whole way and legalise smack and crystal meth, get the whole population hooked on it, and then tax the sales of it. Before long all these government debts will have been paid off and everything will be sorted.
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Old 13th June 2010, 11:51 PM   #93
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Lack of tobacco revenue will be offset by lack of healthcare costs related to emphysema, lung cancer and secondary illness.
I'm not convinced that it costs more to care for a smoker who dies from lung cancer at 55 than it does to care for a non-smoker who lives to 100 in a care home and then dies of cancer anyway.
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Old 14th June 2010, 12:10 AM   #94
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Smokers have a choice to smoke. Non-smokers do not have a choice to receive second hand smoke. Human life is more important than tobacco revenue and the right to impose smoking on others.
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Old 14th June 2010, 12:14 PM   #95
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I'm not convinced that it costs more to care for a smoker who dies from lung cancer at 55 than it does to care for a non-smoker who lives to 100 in a care home and then dies of cancer anyway.
My thoughts too.

As I said I am a non-smoker, but having recently seen several relatives being cared for in homes with dementia dribbling and wetting themselves, I do feel that a quick end is going to be much better than this undignified end to my life.
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Old 14th June 2010, 12:17 PM   #96
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Originally Posted by ValenciaSon View Post
Smokers have a choice to smoke. Non-smokers do not have a choice to receive second hand smoke. .............

An you also have a choice not to enter any location which you do not like.
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Old 14th June 2010, 02:25 PM   #97
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I just read this about Cancer.
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/health/10295126.stm
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Old 14th June 2010, 02:36 PM   #98
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Originally Posted by ribeirasacra View Post
My thoughts too.

As I said I am a non-smoker, but having recently seen several relatives being cared for in homes with dementia dribbling and wetting themselves, I do feel that a quick end is going to be much better than this undignified end to my life.
Free ciggies and booze for the wrinklies?
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Old 14th June 2010, 03:04 PM   #99
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Free ciggies and booze for the wrinklies?

Wrinkles? Moi? Question; does botox treatment give you cancer?
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Old 14th June 2010, 03:29 PM   #100
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An you also have a choice not to enter any location which you do not like.
Right, but that's sort of the crucial point in my opinion. Smoking should be banned in places where workers (who don't have a choice) have to spend long hours every day. I have no problem with the existence of places where people can smoke, such as "smokers' clubs" and the like, as long as tax-paying employees are not required to expose themselves to a dangerous yet easily controllable environmental toxin.
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